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Discussion Starter · #181 ·
Speaking of buttons. The last time had my primary off, when I pressed the sheaves together, they would stay together. The spring should push them back apart right? It seems where my buttons slide up & down the "towers" is too tight. I'm thinking about hitting the "towers" with some very fine grit sand paper so the buttons can slide on them more easily & the sheaves can open/close freely as they should. Maybe this will take care of my jumpy/shuttering low rpm belt engagement?
That is exactly how my buttons were for 2000 miles. I started putting a little moly grease in them before every ride and it helped. Tight buttons is the cause of a lot of problems I think. Mine finally loosened up and let me get the most out of the clutch tune for a few trips and then they were gone. For those few trips it worked the way I always thought it should. Even with the buttons completely gone the clutch worked better than with them too tight. It just made some crazy noises when it was idling.
 

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Is it possible the moly grease softened the buttons? Some plastics don't do well when in contact with petroleum products.

When I raced a CVT car in the early 90's, we used a spray-on dry moly film on the helix ramps. I don't remember doing the clutch towers. If I were to try this now, I would probably try a Teflon liquid or spray.

I replaced a grooved primary at about 800 miles. The replacement was really stiff compared to the original, but not as stiff as what drpalo found. I'll check it again - I'm at almost 2500.
 

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Discussion Starter · #183 ·
Is it possible the moly grease softened the buttons? Some plastics don't do well when in contact with petroleum products.
No, the buttons that are left are still perfectly hard. They are known to blow out like this if you don't pay attention to them. And to be honest I had not payed any attention to them for a little too long. I might have been able to keep them alive a little longer if I had kept up with the cleaning and greasing
 

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Discussion Starter · #184 ·
I got it back together and the .030 shim under the spider dropped the engagement about 100rpm. Progress!

Engagement without killing the top end has been my goal from the beginning. I had a setup that I liked and this might be slightly better. I changed nothing but the shim as far as setup goes. We'll see when I open it up at Jawbone next week. I got a little over 9000rpm up my driveway so it might be pretty good

The Speedwerx PTO and buttons are really quiet so far
 

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Discussion Starter · #186 ·
I probably screwed up the test of the new clutch parts by getting new tires. My 32" Motohammers were worn down to almost nothing so I decided to get a new set. I love these tires and didn't want to take a chance trying something else. I didn't realize how much bigger they were new. So now I've added about 7lbs per corner and at least an inch in height. I would have pulled a magnet out of the weights if I thought about how much different it would be. Too late now. I'm done messing with it

I guess we'll se how much it affects the clutch tune in a couple days
 

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Ok Crawler, or any of you clutch guys...I just installed Crawler's setup....with 2-0-0-0 in the arms. Did a quick couple street miles....high engagement, 2800-3000...9750 with ease....lays rubber with the heavy 32's.
I need to bring engagement down. Should I start with 3-1 or 2-2? TIA
 

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Under what circumstances are you seeing 9750, and are you okay with that? When do the rods start letting go in these Yamahas (obviously at lower RPM for the '18s and early '19s than the engines built after that)?
 

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Discussion Starter · #189 ·
Ok Crawler, or any of you clutch guys...I just installed Crawler's setup....with 2-0-0-0 in the arms. Did a quick couple street miles....high engagement, 2800-3000...9750 with ease....lays rubber with the heavy 32's.
I need to bring engagement down. Should I start with 3-1 or 2-2? TIA
I like all the weight in the heal. It might be a personal preference thing or maybe driving style or terrain. I don't really know which one would be better to be honest but I would start with the 3-1. I'm running 3-0-0-0 now and it was just right with my worn 32's. With new 32's we'll see.

This would be so easy if everything was the same but unfortunately nothing is exactly the same. The weight of your tires and the pressure you run, how much shit you carry, the weight of your foot, the actual rate of your springs, the drag on your buttons, the wear on pretty much everything, what day of the week your motor was built, you get the point.

It sounds like the parts are working pretty good for you and with a couple more magnets you'll be right there. I'd be curious to hear which is better, 3-1 or 2-2, or you might even end up at 3-2. At this point it depends how many times you want to mess with it before you decide it's good enough
 

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Under what circumstances are you seeing 9750, and are you okay with that? When do the rods start letting go in these Yamahas (obviously at lower RPM for the '18s and early '19s than the engines built after that)?
About anytime I stab it. I was in neighborhood but did see 60mph. Figure some more weight down low might tame the top end down some.
 

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Ok...added weights today. I'm at 3-1-0-0...lowered engagement to around 26-2700, pulls hard at 9550-9600. Im gonna throw another magnet in there. See what 3-2 does.
Also, I lost a little engine braking with the BD 35-45. I'm gonna miss that in the mountains.
 

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Any new clutching info out there? I'm picking up a new 21 in the morning and want it to be set up right from the start. Wouldn't that be great! Lol... I know there's always a million things a guy can do, but clutching is my first mod. Anyone sold on there set up?
 

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Anyone sold on there set up?
That all personal preference based on driving style, tires (not all 32's are created equal) and mods as well, someone with a full exhaust, intake and tune will but [utting out more power and need fdifferent clutching than someone with otherwise identical tire setup. Throw in altitude and big humidity or temp differences and again clutching will change....
 

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That all personal preference based on driving style, tires (not all 32's are created equal) and mods as well, someone with a full exhaust, intake and tune will but [utting out more power and need fdifferent clutching than someone with otherwise identical tire setup. Throw in altitude and big humidity or temp differences and again clutching will change....
2021 All stock machine. Just looking to see if anyone found a good stock clutch combo. I did find out yesterday that the clutches are still way to noisy. Anyone have good luck on the speedwerx fix for the noisy clutch? The clutching is better than my 2018 for sure.
 

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2021 All stock machine. Just looking to see if anyone found a good stock clutch combo. I did find out yesterday that the clutches are still way to noisy. Anyone have good luck on the speedwerx fix for the noisy clutch? The clutching is better than my 2018 for sure.
If you read earlier in this post you will see the Speedwerx PTO get's rid of alot of the noise in the primary. It's a solid mod. I also have it and it along with the Speedwerx air intake relocation kit helps the noise tremendously. The PTO mod. is "pinned" on this forum so you can see the installation. We use several clutch combo's that work very well. Depends on your elevation and tire size. We ride from Moab, Utah to 11,500 elevation in Colorado. We use Speedwerx, EPI and Venom parts. If you want help with clutching you got to let us know what you have for elevation and riding style? (Fast desert or slow rock crawling, trails)
 

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I decided to take Winch Warrior's advice. I'm waiting for my friend to make me a .030 shim tomorrow before I put everything back together so I thought I would do a little show and tell.

Here's some of the stuff I've been playing with. Old parts, new parts, sacrificed parts, custom parts.

View attachment 252765

Speedwerx was out of stock on some of the clutch tools and I didn't really want to spend another $500 anyway so I made my own. It worked great.

A couple of the rollers in the spider were pretty worn so I decided to cut apart a Wildcat X primary I had on the shelf to see if they are the same. Perfect fit!

The X buttons are also the same size but they are solid where the XX buttons have a cavity in the backside that holds a little rubber star, I guess to hold tension or absorb shock. Since I lost some of the buttons I also lost the stars and the Speedwerx buttons don't come with them. I used a gasket punch to make some rubber slugs to put in there and they seem to fit well.

View attachment 252766
X button, XX buttons, Speedwerx buttons, inserts I made

I got a cheap 1 7/16 6-point deep socket off Amazon that I thought I would have to cut and extend but it was just deep enough to get the nut off. Lucky

Since I got the Speedwerx PTO shaft, I used the stock PTO as a primary holder. I welded some bolts to a plate that hold the fins, and welded that plate to the PTO shaft, and then welded the PTO to a big plate that I could park my truck on and made a spider wrench that I could put a pipe on. I figured if I was going to do it I was going to make it easy. Spider came right off
View attachment 252767


Since I have the clutch off I might as well install the Speed waterpump kit that I bought a while back even though I did the Speedwerx mod and don't really need it now
Glad the primary shim got you a litlle better engagement. We are seeing around 300 rpm reduction with the Speedwerx weights with the .030 primary shim. We are testing and tuning with a .060 and .080 shim currently for lower engagement. Seeing some really nice results so far with the EPI 60-200 spring with the .060 & .080 shims. The weights profile are different from manufacture to manufacture. That's why we are seeing a little different results with the Speedwerx weights and the .030, .060 and .080 shims.
 

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What is everyone using to compress the primary when installing taller/heavier springs? I have the Venom and SLP compressor. Venom isnt tall enough with the new spring and the SLP is simply just to hard to use when trying to compress aftermarket springs. I have been using a floor mount hydraulic press which is way overkill. Looking for something more mobile to use while im out testing so I can do primary adjustments away from my shop.
 

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Discussion Starter · #199 ·
What is everyone using to compress the primary when installing taller/heavier springs? I have the Venom and SLP compressor. Venom isnt tall enough with the new spring and the SLP is simply just to hard to use when trying to compress aftermarket springs. I have been using a floor mount hydraulic press which is way overkill. Looking for something more mobile to use while im out testing so I can do primary adjustments away from my shop.
Primary spring should be easy to install by hand. Even the heavier springs I've tried were pretty easy to push in with one hand while installing the bolts with the other hand, on the car with the belt installed
 
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